13 Responses to “Cloture Defeated”

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1. Sue Says:

   June 28th, 2007 at 12:57 pm
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   Now we will wait and see what the next issue is that the hard liners can use to fracture the party even further.

   The bill in its current form was not one that was acceptable but now we have no starting point with which to work.

   I am not celebrating as many are today as IMHO you don’t get from here to there standing still.

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2. Big Mo Says:

   June 28th, 2007 at 12:58 pm
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   John Hawkins has the dancing Snoopy on his site right now. That’s one happy camper!
   

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3. Sue Says:

   June 28th, 2007 at 3:13 pm
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   Big Mo:

   As are many of the prominent bloggers.

   They are all patting themselves on the back today but other than a few I have not seen them offer any alternatives which would be acceptable to both parties.

   This is a tough issue and I do not pretend to be smart enough to have the answers but I cannot find myself abandoning or degrading the President because of a view which is contrary.

   I suppose the next Clinton White House will have the answers and more power to them if they do.

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4. Big Mo Says:

   June 28th, 2007 at 3:40 pm
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   I nearly choked on my diet Coke when I read “next Clinton White House”!

   I wonder, though, if some conservatives realize they were acting exactly the same as the people at the DU and Daily Kos?

   Some opposed this bill with class. Others… completely classless.

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5. Sue Says:

   June 28th, 2007 at 3:55 pm
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   Big Mo:

   I hope you did not choke, I would not want to feel responsible. LOL

   I said that because if those who were “classless” on this issue find a distaste for the Republican candidate they will do the same as they did in 2006 and I fear many will heed their words and either stay home or vote for a third party candidate out of spite.

   I also read many who handled this with class and will continue to read them. I just have never been one to attack something with which I disagree unless I feel I could offer a viable solution. That does not mean I feel this bill should have passed, it just means I like to at least try to give some credit to those who tried to solve a problem this country has faced for some 40 years.

   Hope now you can enjoy the rest of that coke.

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6. ~J~ Says:

   June 28th, 2007 at 3:57 pm
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   I may have shown my feelings on this bill, but I have tried to just remain neutral in my postings. I’m not sure if I was successful, but I was determined I was not going to attack the president and call him Spanish names as an insult to him.

   I was certain I was not going to ask people to not vote for certain senators because they voted for cloture on Tuesday.

   I thought this was a bad bill because it was done in a back room and not done the way bills are usually done. There should have been committee hearings in the open with the Senators listening to their constituents’ opinions, even if they eventually disregarded them.

   The bill should have passed a committee and been referred to the floor and debated along with any amendments put forth. This would have made for a stronger bill, but instead we had people go behind our backs and write a 400 page bill without having time to have anyone read and digest its contents.

   Amendments were all meant to be tabled in the clay pigeon tactic, and when one of them didn’t get tabled it meant they had to call for cloture so they couldn’t debate the bill.

   This is not the way legislation is supposed to be made, and if it had gone through the regular process we may have had the foundations for a bill that could have been a good start to build on in future years.

   I am not rejoicing it didn’t pass, but I’m not sorry about it either. I’m just tired of all the fair weather conservatives who are breaking their arms today patting themselves on the back when yesterday they were slandering our president and any senator who voted for the first cloture.

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7. Sue Says:

   June 28th, 2007 at 4:14 pm
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   J:

   Bingo..I wish some others would learn that it is best to hold your fire until all the facts come out in the wash and the votes are tallied. It is okay to have an opinion on anything but to set out to ruin careers because you disagree with a particular politician or the position they hold on an issue is childlike.

   Heck, I’ve got Arlen Specter, plenty to disagree with there and have but I would never call for his resignation, recall etc., as there are many others in this state who like and admire the man. They too are entitled to their opinion.

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8. Big Mo Says:

   June 28th, 2007 at 4:25 pm
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   Check out DJ Drummond’s essay on this. He’s absolutely spot on — and naturally will catch a lot of flung poo because of it.

   http://wizbangblog.com/2007/06/28/what-now-on-immigration-and-the-border.php

   Oh - the Coke’s still good!
   :”>

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9. Sue Says:

   June 28th, 2007 at 4:42 pm
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   I did see DJ’s piece today, thought it was great and he is so often one of the well reasoned writers on the web. AJ Strata was another I followed as he may have taken the position that the bill should pass, (which I may not have agreed with) but he was well reasoned and thoughtful.

   Do you think we can find enough people to read them instead of the ones who believe we are sheep?

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10. Ayschlay Says:

    June 28th, 2007 at 9:32 pm
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    I glanced at several responses to Drummond’s posting. Lots of fear and anger still, and dubious claims, like illegal immigrants pay no taxes–just plain wrong; it’s all the employers’ fault–when has anything ever been the fault of one group? better fences on the Mexican border will reduce flows, ignoring the many that come in other ways, or are hear on overstays (David made this point earlier on another posting).

    And the overarching message–it’s all Congress’ fault. And it’s an issue Congress can solve.

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11. Ayschlay Says:

    June 29th, 2007 at 9:46 am
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    Regarding my last post, I meant to say:

    As if it were an issue Congress could solve if those goofballs would just work together. Migration is about as easy to control as our national economy.

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12. Big Mo Says:

    June 29th, 2007 at 10:20 am
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    Ayschlay - YEP and YEP!

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13. ~J~ Says:

    June 29th, 2007 at 10:34 am
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    Everyone complains about our southern border but not about our northern border. Isn’t Canada the point of entry for the terrorists who got on a plane in Portland, Maine, and flew to Boston to get on a bigger flight?

    Why are we not concerned about our northern border too?

    I hate to say it, but is it a racial thing? I mean, if we want to protect our country it seems we would want to protect both borders and both coasts.